[Gambas-devel] for future gambas development

[Daniel Campos]

Hi:

There are two approachs to export interfaces:

1) The first one tries to reuse the current servers (Apache,IIS) available,
as well as trying to be compatible with the current clients (IE, Firefox,
may be Konqueror). This approach have many problems, as it needs to force
those servers to stablish continuous connections using hacks (a continuous
ping made in JavaScript and using HttpRequest - note that XML is not
mandatory for that task - from the client, having in account the different
way to work of the different servers), and needs to hack lot of things in
client code to manage all the differences between the different clients, as
well as the bugs of the different versions of the same client. As a result
of this, the code written in that way is bloated, unstable and slow. The
client part uses to implement the interfaces with the Canvas object of
Firefox and emulations of that Canvas available for IE. At the end, these
implementations are useful to create simple and apparent shows, but fails to
create a stable and  complete environment. JavaScript is a bad tool for this
too, even if the idea of that language is good, it lacks many important
features to manage the DOM tree with efficience. There has been an effort in
that sense to manage the graphical Skeak environment in that way, however I
doubt it will be released as free software.

2) The second approach is to take the good things of the current model
(parts of XML, JavaScript, HTTP protocol and web servers and clients), and
create with this base a real environment to export interfaces, instead of
fixes and patches over the current tools, that were designed only to export
and display static documents. This approach is beeing develop in the Futura
project from Linex (
http://forjamari.linex.org/plugins/wiki/index.php?id=54&type=g ) and will
allow compatiblity between the current toolkits available (GTK+ at this
moment) and the current idea of exporting interfaces using HTTP servers. The
main idea is that the base toolkit will manage the interface in a
transparent way for the application, so it will be rendered directly on the
machine in local applications, and use a specialized server and XML to
export it to remote machines, without any change in the user application.
The client server part is designed on Webkit, initially developed for
MacOSX, but soon available for GNU/Linux and any other system capable of run
GTK+ thanks to the work of Mike Emmel (the graphical part) and Brian Morda
(the XML-HTTP streams). That way there will be all the pieces needed for
that task: an unified version of JavaScript (3.0?), a specialized,
convenient  and not bloated web server to export the interfaces, an unified
client to show the interfaces and manage HTML/XML/DOM in a unique way.
Gambas, Python or C programmers should not care about the toolkit to use and
the internals of the implementations, as the toolkit will manage it directly
(drawing directly on a graphic or managing HTTP and XML streams, and
converting the things needed to JavaScript)

So at this moment I do not think the web graphical toolkit of Gambas is a
priority, and implement it with current technologies would probably carry
that project to a dead point, when receiving tons of reports of differences
in the performance when using any of the different versions of any
traditional web client available, even if Comet would help a lot in the
server side (that's true).

Daniel


2006/8/20, Ron Onstenk <ronstk at ...124...>:
>
> On Sunday 20 August 2006 11:47, José L. Redrejo Rodríguez wrote:
> > Hi Benoît. In previous emails we have talked about a future use of
> > gambas for web development,
>
> Quanta?
>
> > doing it as easy as it is now to switch from qt to gtk.
>
> The first thing I saw:
>
>   GUI Toolkit
>    Despite being a pure JavaScript framework, qooxdoo is quite on par with
>    GUI toolkits like Qt, SWT and others when it comes to advanced yet easy
>    to implement user
>
> Why drop QT and go GTK?
>
>
> > I've found this toolkit that could do it possible. It's  lgpl licensed
> > and looks really promising:
>
> Start making of gb.qooxddoo component and we do not need gb.qt and gb.gtkanymore.
>
> >
> > http://qooxdoo.org/about
> >
> > Regards.
> >
>
> I just like gambas for the basic Basic.
> We have already apache, php, phpgtk, tcl, quanta, kate and
> many others for web development and runtime.
>
> Just again a thing of AJAX hype.
> In The netherlands we have a football club, cleaning liquid,
> fire extinguishers and a gas cylinder company company with
> that name 'Ajax' the whole day around us. :)
>
>
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