[Gambas-user] Question: Is it possible to build 'plugins/add ons' for Gambas applications

Wed Oct 3 18:03:58 CEST 2012

On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 12:55 PM, William Cabrera
<cabrerawilliam at ...626...> wrote:
> the problem is with the functions of the plugin, as the application will
> know what features the plugin?
>
> 2012/10/3 Sebastian Kulesz <sebikul at ...626...>
>
>> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 9:23 AM, Fabien Bodard <gambas.fr at ...626...> wrote:
>> > 2012/10/3 Benoît Minisini <gambas at ...1...>:
>> >> Le 03/10/2012 12:22, Ron a écrit :
>> >>> On 3-10-2012 2:58, Willy Raets wrote:
>> >>>> On Wed, 2012-10-03 at 08:26 +0930, Bruce wrote:
>> >>>>> On Tue, 2012-10-02 at 23:03 +0200, Willy Raets wrote:
>> >>>>>> Hi.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I recently had a request of someone if it is possible to build a
>> >>>>>> plugin/add on for my existing Gambas application.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I like the idea, as it would give extra function to my application.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> So would it be possible to write applications that, once installed,
>> add
>> >>>>>> something to my application, like the add ons for Firefox for
>> example.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Would this be possible with Gambas?
>> >>>>>> If so, how to set up the main application to except these
>> plugins/add
>> >>>>>> ons?
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I anyone could point me into the good direction it would be much
>> >>>>>> appreciated.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Willy
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> P.S. Would it be possible to have plugins/add ons written in for
>> example
>> >>>>>> Java added to a Gambas application? Or am I going to far in my mind
>> :)
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>> Hi Willy,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> The concept is feasible, but requires some effort on your part to
>> >>>>> implement the following:
>> >>>>> 1) a plug in manager for your app to let the user register and start
>> the
>> >>>>> plug in.
>> >>>> That is what I kind of figured out :)
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> 2) an object model for your app data that safely exposes the data in
>> >>>>> some way:
>> >>>>>     a) dbus?
>> >>>>>     b) directly passing the data to the plug-in?
>> >>>>>     c) using interface files?
>> >>>>> 3) if you want to allow the plug in to modify the data, then some
>> sort
>> >>>>> of interface to recognize modification requests and apply them
>> >>>>> (judiciously of course).  Again, gb.dbus messaging and gb.signal look
>> >>>>> the most sophisticated approach.
>> >>>> Seems I'll have to dive into gb.dbus
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> Some weeks ago I proposed adding such functionality to the IDE
>> itself.
>> >>>>> In that post there is a mocked up proof of concept for step 1.  I
>> didn't
>> >>>>> take it any further as there was little interest expressed.  We have
>> >>>>> added it to our local gambas installation and taken it further.
>> >>>>> However, no data that is within the IDE is exposed to the add-ins
>> (as I
>> >>>>> didn't want or need to do that).  Our IDE add-ins work outside the
>> IDE
>> >>>>> to provide some developer aids and at the most add new files to the
>> >>>>> project.  Some examples are: a "class-builder" that reads a UML xmi
>> file
>> >>>>> and creates a new class with the majority of the property handling
>> code
>> >>>>> already implemented; a "installer" that installs an automake package
>> of
>> >>>>> the project with little user intervention; a "todo list " manager
>> that
>> >>>>> goes far beyond the IDE tasks panel to manage to-dos, bugs, ideas,
>> etc;
>> >>>>> and a stockview type of icon/image manager that previews any/all of
>> our
>> >>>>> icon libraries and allows importing of icons into the project
>> directory.
>> >>>>> So, nothing that actually modifies the active code within the IDE,
>> the
>> >>>>> only data that is passed to the add-ins is the project path. Other
>> than
>> >>>>> adding files to the project the only other back interface is via the
>> >>>>> clipboard. For example, the stock viewer copies the path of the
>> clicked
>> >>>>> icon onto the clipboard in the format needed for a Picture["path"]
>> >>>>> command.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> If you want to look at the POC search the mail archives for
>> "Proposal" -
>> >>>>> it was some time in August.  I don't think we have an archive of it,
>> but
>> >>>>> if you can't find the post then pm me and I'll have a look though
>> system
>> >>>>> backups for it.
>> >>>> Ok I found your post about it and downloaded the archives. Archives
>> >>>> won't open somehow :(
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Reason it gives:
>> >>>> tar: This does not look like a tar archive
>> >>>> tar: Skipping to next header
>> >>>> tar: Exiting with failure status due to previous errors
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So I hope you still have them lying around somewhere.
>> >>>> Their names where (might help retrieving them):
>> >>>> addinmeta1-0.0.6.tar.gz
>> >>>> paddys-hill-runterm_simple-0.0.2.tar.gz
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Very curious about this...
>> >>>>> I'd say that dbus would be the way to go for part 2 as it is a
>> >>>>> convenient way to encapsulate and expose your object data model.
>> >>>> If I get part 1 done (guess your example will come in helpfull to get
>> me
>> >>>> going) I'll have a good look at dbus and it's possibilities.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> regards
>> >>>>> Bruce
>> >>>>>
>> >>>> Thanks again..
>> >>>> You are always very helpful and seem to be thinking and doing a lot
>> I'm
>> >>>> thinking and trying to do :)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Willy
>> >>>>
>> >>>> BTW, I like your idea of being able to add plugins to the IDE as you
>> >>>> suggested. I can think of some useful additions off my own that would
>> >>>> speed up some routine tasks often needed during development.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>> Willy,
>> >>>
>> >>> Search for the file names online, download the files from the found
>> list
>> >>> archive and open them with 7zip (windows, yuk) right click choose "open
>> >>> archive".
>> >>> Then click on the files until you see the list of contents, you can
>> then
>> >>> drag them to a folder.
>> >>> Simply unpacking directly indeed results in one strange text file with
>> >>> all files concatenated in it.
>> >>>
>> >>> I'm also looking at some way of creating plugins/define an api for my
>> >>> project! (domotiga)
>> >>> So people can code a plugin as a gambas component, place it in a
>> >>> directory (plugins) and the main software will scan/find and register
>> it.
>> >>>
>> >>> I looked at this info also...
>> >>>
>> http://www.gambasforge.org/code-55-application-modulaire--des-plugins-pour-votre-appli.html
>> >>> but haven't got it to work just yet the way I want it.
>> >>> So keep me posted if you want, when you succeed in creating a POC ;)
>> >>>
>> >>> Regards,
>> >>> Ron.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> Technically, even if it is strange, plugins are not really necessary
>> >> with Gambas.
>> >>
>> >> As plugins usually depends on the main program version, you can put all
>> >> plugins in the main program. Anyway, the Gambas interpreter will load
>> >> the plugin code only if it is used.
>> >>
>> >> The only problem is when many different people work on different plugins
>> >> located in the same source code.
>> >>
>> >> If the version requirement is strong enough (like Gambas with its main
>> >> component), it is not a big deal.
>> >>
>> >> Otherwise, if you really want people to develop their plugins
>> >> independently, you have to create components or libraries.
>> >>
>> >> Libraries are actually the good way: you put them in the same directory
>> >> than the main executable so that it can find them, and that's all.
>> >>
>> >> I think you can load them at runtime with Component.Load(), just check.
>> >> Otherwise you are doomed - But I will fix that, this is the goal. And
>> >> maybe we should be able to put plugins in their own directory somewhere,
>> >> but then I have to modify Component.Load() to deal with absolute paths.
>> > Yes i think it is needed
>> >>
>> >> Now, to create a plugin API :
>> >>
>> >> 1) Having everything in the main program is the easier path. You can do
>> >> what you want. A shared module, using inheritance, and so on. I think
>> >> you should try to do that as much as possible. Note that there is less
>> >> security problems, as the control is done at the source code level. And
>> >> fixing the problem is fast when everything is at the same place.
>> >>
>> >> 2) If the plugin is a library : that's the problem. It is not easy at
>> >> all, but it is an IDE problem : the library (plugin) project should be
>> >> able to use the main project as if it is a component or a library, so
>> >> that if the plugin interface is an exported class of the main program,
>> >> then the plugin can use it directly with no compilation error. I must
>> >> think a litle about that...
>> > DBUS ?
>>
>> DBus IS the way to go. A plugin could be any class that depends on
>> DBusObject. When a plugin is loaded (simply executed, even from a
>> shell), a Main function is executed which registers the object and
>> enters in to an infinite loop.  It can expose an Exit() method to
>> quit, etc. It requires no additional work! what do you think?
>>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Benoît Minisini
>> >>
>> >>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Fabien Bodard
>> >
>> >
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>
>>
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>
> ------
> William Cabrera
> http://willicab.gnu.org.ve
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Maybe we could create hooks all around the IDE's code and let plugins
subscribe a specific method to any hook. There are other ways too!